Question
Updated on
16 Jun 2018
- English (US)
-
Japanese
Question about Japanese
Q 最も良いものを1・2・3・4から一つ選びなさい。
新幹線ができたら、東京と大阪の往復がずっと時間短縮できたのですから、そのぶん、ビジネスマンたちは楽になっても良かったのですが、実際には、「 X 」商談をまとめて日帰りの出張ができると、かえって忙しくなった人の方が多かった。
1)この距離くらいなら
2)この距離くらいでは
3)これほどの距離があれば
4)これほどの距離では
what is the difference between these four options and why are they wrong/right?
(additional question: そのぶん、ビジネスマンたちは楽になっても良かったのですが <- how do i interpret 楽になっても良かった?)
Here is what I thought:
there are two categories:
この距離くらい vs これほどの距離
なら・あれば vs では
they seem very similar to me, I don't understand the difference between them enough.
Q 最も良いものを1・2・3・4から一つ選びなさい。
新幹線ができたら、東京と大阪の往復がずっと時間短縮できたのですから、そのぶん、ビジネスマンたちは楽になっても良かったのですが、実際には、「 X 」商談をまとめて日帰りの出張ができると、かえって忙しくなった人の方が多かった。
1)この距離くらいなら
2)この距離くらいでは
3)これほどの距離があれば
4)これほどの距離では
what is the difference between these four options and why are they wrong/right?
(additional question: そのぶん、ビジネスマンたちは楽になっても良かったのですが <- how do i interpret 楽になっても良かった?)
Here is what I thought:
there are two categories:
この距離くらい vs これほどの距離
なら・あれば vs では
they seem very similar to me, I don't understand the difference between them enough.
新幹線ができたら、東京と大阪の往復がずっと時間短縮できたのですから、そのぶん、ビジネスマンたちは楽になっても良かったのですが、実際には、「 X 」商談をまとめて日帰りの出張ができると、かえって忙しくなった人の方が多かった。
1)この距離くらいなら
2)この距離くらいでは
3)これほどの距離があれば
4)これほどの距離では
what is the difference between these four options and why are they wrong/right?
(additional question: そのぶん、ビジネスマンたちは楽になっても良かったのですが <- how do i interpret 楽になっても良かった?)
Here is what I thought:
there are two categories:
この距離くらい vs これほどの距離
なら・あれば vs では
they seem very similar to me, I don't understand the difference between them enough.
Answers
16 Jun 2018
Featured answer
- Japanese
@osora
Wow, it must be a tough question for Japanese learners!
1. You can think it in terms of process of elimination this way. “では” accompanies a negative phrase after that such as “これでは書けない(With this, I can’t write.).” So eliminate 2) and 4) first because the following clause says “...出張できる.” Now “くらいなら” in 1) means “if this much” and 3) means “if there is such a distance.”
2. “その分” means “instead”, “in return” or “accordingly”, so the entire sentence means “instead, it would have been ok even if businessmen had gotten more comfortable, but.”
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- Japanese
この距離くらい is usually used if the distance is NOT too long.
これほどの距離 is usually used if the distance is too long.
なら and (あれ)ば are used for a condition.
では is usually used for a negative sentence.
So I think 1 is the most natural.
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- Japanese
@osora
Wow, it must be a tough question for Japanese learners!
1. You can think it in terms of process of elimination this way. “では” accompanies a negative phrase after that such as “これでは書けない(With this, I can’t write.).” So eliminate 2) and 4) first because the following clause says “...出張できる.” Now “くらいなら” in 1) means “if this much” and 3) means “if there is such a distance.”
2. “その分” means “instead”, “in return” or “accordingly”, so the entire sentence means “instead, it would have been ok even if businessmen had gotten more comfortable, but.”
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1)(商品が) この価格くらいなら・・・払える / 買える
2)(持ち金が) この金額くらいでは・・・払えない / 買えない
3)これほどの お金があれば・・・払える / 買える
4)これほどの お金では・・・買えない
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- English (US)
@Hiroshi212 i see! i did not know that では accompanies a negative phrase, it wasn't written anywhere in the textbook haha... thank you very much for the easy-to-understand explanation for both 1 and 2!
- Japanese
@rakujin You are welcome. Glad to hear that. :)
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@rakujin
I have a question. Maybe in English, you have no words to distinguish では from なら, right? You need to judge from the context, right?
For example, if you talk about the amount of ink for drawing, they go
With this much, I can’t draw a picture. (The amount is small.)
With this much, I can draw a picture. (The amount is barely enough.)
Both sentences can use “with this much.” Am I correct?
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@Hiroshi212 hmm...
Usually, when i hear people say 'with this much', it is usually for a large amount. for example: "with this much money, i can buy two or even three houses."/"with this much paint, i can draw more than two pieces of art."
when i want to say an amount is small/not enough, i would say "with this little (amount of) paint, i can't even draw one full picture."
when i want to say an amount is just nice, i would just say "with this amount of paint, i can draw just what i intend to draw." without saying much or little.
Hence, i would say that your first example is not too common (but still plausible), and that the second example sounds reasonable (though not always with the nuance of 'barely enough'). As such, i think that helping words like little/much, or, as what you say, context, help to distinguish the nuance.
Hope i answered your question clearly enough! I'm not a grammar expert, so i can only answer based on my own anecdotal experiences.
Usually, when i hear people say 'with this much', it is usually for a large amount. for example: "with this much money, i can buy two or even three houses."/"with this much paint, i can draw more than two pieces of art."
when i want to say an amount is small/not enough, i would say "with this little (amount of) paint, i can't even draw one full picture."
when i want to say an amount is just nice, i would just say "with this amount of paint, i can draw just what i intend to draw." without saying much or little.
Hence, i would say that your first example is not too common (but still plausible), and that the second example sounds reasonable (though not always with the nuance of 'barely enough'). As such, i think that helping words like little/much, or, as what you say, context, help to distinguish the nuance.
Hope i answered your question clearly enough! I'm not a grammar expert, so i can only answer based on my own anecdotal experiences.
- Japanese
@rakujin
Ohhhh thank you for your explanation! I asked you that for you to understand “なら” and “では.” If that is the case, “この距離くらいなら...” in your original question can be translated as “thinking they could complete business negotiations and do a day trip with this short distance.”
“この距離くらいでは” can be used in a sentence such as “they can’t even use their PCs in the train with this short distance.”
Am I correct?? Can you correct my sentences if they are wrong?
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@Hiroshi212 ahhh i see! yup, i think those are both good (natural) translations. thank you.
Also, i just realised something. initially, i was also confused about と in ...日帰りの出張ができると. I had thought it was the conditional と, but at the same time, i was doubtful that this conditional と could be used in the way the passage used it (which is with a なら in the clause).
However, what you said in your latest reply ".. can be translated as "thinking they could..."...", am I correct to say that the と is not the conditional と, but instead a quotation particle, with 考えて・思って abbreviated?
Also, i just realised something. initially, i was also confused about と in ...日帰りの出張ができると. I had thought it was the conditional と, but at the same time, i was doubtful that this conditional と could be used in the way the passage used it (which is with a なら in the clause).
However, what you said in your latest reply ".. can be translated as "thinking they could..."...", am I correct to say that the と is not the conditional と, but instead a quotation particle, with 考えて・思って abbreviated?
- Japanese
- English (US)
@Hiroshi212 i see now! (one of the reasons why i didn't choose answer 1 was because i was confused by this と, but now i understand) thank you!
- Japanese
@rakujin You’re welcome. Incidentally, do you know which one is the answer?
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@rakujin Oh ok. I’m relieved lol
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